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Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
493
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 06:13:00 -
[1] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:
The Mittani encouraged others to go after someone[i] in order to drive them to suicide
No he didn't, many may have interpreted it that way. And my story was in response that if u can ban one person for calling on a group of others to target a single individule, then that would mean what we did was wrong and against the EULA aswell. Which is actually where my interest lies in this topic. I dont care about morals or suicide, mittani, goons, or the CSM. I only care about how the rules of the game are being interpreted and how it may affect me.
Review the video again. You must have missed the part where Mittens solicited audience members to join and "help" make the guy commit suicide. It was pretty clear. There was no interpretation of his wording. He SOLICITED help specifically for the purposes of driving the guy to suicide. Whether he meant it or not is irrelevant. It's one of those things like yelling "FIRE" in a public space when there is no fire. People can get hurt, so therefore you're held accountable.
A better example is getting on the radio or a television broadcast and soliciting people to rise up to destroy public/private property and to commit bodily harm to others. Inciting people to violence is against the law in most countries whether or not damaging or injurious actions have taken place.
We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |

Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
497
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 14:28:00 -
[2] - Quote
Kale Kold wrote:If it was all pre-meditated then Mittani should be permabanned!
It was premeditated. The slide proved it. The "Drinks with Bolton" video from January of this year is overwhelming proof that Mittens had been planning this for at least 3 months. Drunkenness doesn't even begin to work as an excuse. If this were in a court this would be an open and closed case of premeditated cyber-bullying. The "Drinks with Bolton" video also proves that CCP is complicit in this whole fiasco. No wonder they're locking every thread about the situation except this one buried in the Dev blogs that are about as navigable as a maze with no exit.
Should real authorities get involved I would not want to be Hilmar.
"Drinks with Bolton" featuring CCP Soundwave
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fTRQ05Bqq_E&feature=player_detailpage#t=440s We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |

Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
497
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 14:50:00 -
[3] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Mr Kidd wrote:Kale Kold wrote:If it was all pre-meditated then Mittani should be permabanned! ...CCP is complicit in this whole fiasco. No wonder they're locking every thread about the situation except this one buried in the Dev blogs that are about as navigable as a maze with no exit. Should real authorities get involved I would not want to be Hilmar. Yup I think CCP needs to quickly permanently ban all The Wis's accounts to protect him from cyberbulling, and themselves from possible lawsuits. If he no longer has an account, then he can't be bullied. Problem solved.
Mitanni alt detected. We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |

Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
498
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 15:56:00 -
[4] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Lanasak wrote:There is a huge difference between what he said in that video and what he said at Fanfest. To use that recording as any evidence of the Fanfest debacle being "premeditated" is simple posturing. Get over yourself. Agree'd but lets keep quiet about it and watch more people post to the contrary and prove what mindless sheep they are.
Right, because anytime someone says they're going to do something and then does it, it's completely unrelated. Got me there. I bow to your prowess of logic. We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |

Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
500
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 16:19:00 -
[5] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Mr Kidd wrote:Azran Zala wrote:Lanasak wrote:There is a huge difference between what he said in that video and what he said at Fanfest. To use that recording as any evidence of the Fanfest debacle being "premeditated" is simple posturing. Get over yourself. Agree'd but lets keep quiet about it and watch more people post to the contrary and prove what mindless sheep they are. Right, because anytime someone says they're going to do something and then does it, it's completely unrelated. Got me there. I bow to your prowess of logic. Unfortunately for Mitanni, that video coupled with a prepared slide, the former telegraphing his plan for fanfast & the latter facilitating it, is a clear line of evidence that would indeed support that it was premeditated. No. Because I have the intelect to detect when a bunch of boys are talking crap and one says figuratively how he hopes to tell whiners to go f*** themselves... and the difference between that and a neo-natzi meeting discussing a plot for genocide. And also the fact that no-one at the alliance panel actually told or made anyone to go kill themselves.
But not the intellect to understand this is exactly what happens in cases of bullying right up until it goes too far. Go read about bullying, cases that have seen the light of day and you'll see parents and friends stating exactly what you have, "They were joking., "They didn't mean it", "They're good kids". Alex on the other hand is an adult, a lawyer, and should already be aware of this. I can only conclude that he's a poor adult and a horrible lawyer. We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |

Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
501
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 16:29:00 -
[6] - Quote
Lanasak wrote:Mr Kidd wrote:But not the intellect to understand this is exactly what happens in cases of bullying right up until it goes too far. Go read about bullying, cases that have seen the light of day and you'll see parents and friends stating exactly what you have, "They were joking., "They didn't mean it", "They're good kids". And yet a child was driven to the point of suicide. To blame the dead child for not HTFU is the very definition of sociopathic. Alex is an adult, a lawyer, and should already be aware of this. I can only conclude that he's a poor adult and a horrible lawyer. Perhaps that's why some people say he's a former lawyer. *shrugs* I don't really know either way and I don't really care what he does for a living. I do know he's an adult that for what ever reason, perhaps a lack of self-esteem, is pandering to the worst adolescent behavior. Even sadder is CCP's complicity in this....supposedly a group of adults and professionals. nothing in that interview even hints at bullying so get over it
Except the part outlining how he's going to present, in front of thousands of people at fanfest, people for whom Mitanni wants to commit suicide.
From your reply I've never seen a more clear cut case of selective perception. We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |

Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
501
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 16:33:00 -
[7] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Mr Kidd wrote: But not the intellect to understand this is exactly what happens in cases of bullying right up until it goes too far. Go read about bullying, cases that have seen the light of day and you'll see parents and friends stating exactly what you have, "They were joking., "They didn't mean it", "They're good kids". And yet a child was driven to the point of suicide. Alex on the other hand is an adult, a lawyer, and should already be aware of this. I can only conclude that he's a poor adult and a horrible lawyer.
Pardom me if I refrain from speculation. The only thing that is important is the facts of this case. And so far you have proven no actual correlation between what was said on beers with bolton and what was said at the alliance panel. Besides that he intended to ridicle the antics of miners and titan pilots.
And the person that he specifically named was a miner. Got me again. Absolutely no correlation what-so-ever. The logic is strong in you! We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |

Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
501
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 16:34:00 -
[8] - Quote
Lanasak wrote:Mr Kidd wrote:Except the part outlining how he's going to present, in front of thousands of people at fanfest, people for whom Mitanni wants to commit suicide.
From your reply I've never seen a more clear cut case of selective perception. it's like you're deliberately ignoring the fact that he did not talk about singling a vulnerable player out you're the clear-cut case of selective perception, you want to conclude that it was premeditated so again, what he did at fanfest has nothing to do with what he said in the interview
I'm sorry, did you miss the part where he DID single out a specific player to the point of spelling his name for the benefit of drunken crowd members? We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |

Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
501
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 16:44:00 -
[9] - Quote
Lanasak wrote:Mr Kidd wrote:I'm sorry, did you miss the part where he DID single out a specific player to the point of spelling his name for the benefit of drunken associates?
in the interview? or at fanfest? we're talking about two separate events here bro keep up
They are only two separate events as a matter of when they occurred. Mitanni confessed his intent in the January video. Mitanni followed through by doing exactly that, going to fanfest, soliciting others to push a player to the point of suicide. Both videos, "drinks with bolton" and the fanfest alliance panel a irrevocably linked. One forecasts the action. The other is the action.
It's akin to someone calling you and threatening violence against you with laughter heard in the background months in advance giving you a specific date and time they're going to do it. Then, someone shows up and beats you exactly at the time and date they said they would. You would have us believe, in that instance that you would be completely befuddled and your police report would not reflect the phone call? *face palm* We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |

Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
501
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 16:50:00 -
[10] - Quote
Lanasak wrote:Kara Roideater wrote:Lanasak wrote:Kara Roideater wrote:You're right. In that video he only says he intends to tell people to commit suicide by himself, whereas at fanfest he ended up encouraging others to contribute towards that end. Now, it's true that that is a significant difference. But the Mittani's 'apology' kind of implied that he was sorry about the whole suicide thing and shocked and ashamed that he might have done anything to encourage someone suicidal to go down that road. It certainly didn't state that encouraging people to kill themselves was just business as usual and that he only overstepped the mark by encouraging others to join in. He overstepped the mark by pointing out a vulnerable player rather than saying some tired catchphrase. He overstepped the mark by combining the two. He didn't just indicate the vulnerable player, he indicated him specifically in the context of that kind of 'catchphrase'. I'm sure you'll agree that a major element in the whole clusterfuck is that a phrase that is actually quite serious and is treated as having serious implications if used towards people in RL has become overly trivialised in the minds of many eve players, to the extent that they forget WHY it is offensive and only remember THAT it is offensive. none of this makes it "premeditated"
All I can say is, another Mitanni alt detected. It's not even a nice try Alex. It's a sorry attempt to unlink a clear line of evidence. We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |

Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
501
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 17:19:00 -
[11] - Quote
Azran Zala wrote:Mr Kidd wrote:Lanasak wrote: none of this makes it "premeditated"
All I can say is, another Mitanni alt detected. It's not even a nice try Alex. It's a sorry attempt to unlink a clear line of evidence. Oh look resorting back to baseless accusations in lieu of lack of argument. Are you even trying to form a cohesive sentence or are you just banging your keyboard with your head?
Yes, it's actually a sentence, but requires a modicum of grammatical aptitude to recognize it as such. Is it the big words or the comma's that is causing your confusion?
I only resort to baseless accusations after significant attempts to describe the situation irrefutably and have people refute it. When someone says they're going to do something giving a date, time and place they're going to do it, then shows up at the exact location, date and time they said they would and do exactly what they said they'd do....well, yeah, can't really see how you and others can insist that the two incidents are not related. Should I conclude that your mental faculties are deficient and start using pictures?
Doesn't really matter. You're either Mitanni or troll. And since we know Mitanni is a troll, I did take a leap of logic and assume you were Mitanni. Now, how about using a worn out cliche' in response? We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |

Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
501
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 17:25:00 -
[12] - Quote
Lanasak wrote:sorry, but when you're dragging the lead game designer into this you're going too far
drop the hatchet already
I didn't drag the lead designer into anything. It sounds as if he participated in the "drinks with bolton" interview of his on volition. We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |

Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
501
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 17:37:00 -
[13] - Quote
Lanasak wrote:no, whoever decided to dig up that video got him involved
you're going too far, just drop the hatchet and walk away
No, I'm pretty sure that when someone plans to break a law or EULA or TOS or any other rule set for which there are consequences, anyone that passively stands by and allows it to happen might have some liability. Because someone found evidence to that fact doesn't make them a party guilty of anything or by proxy involved Soundwave. He involved himself and as soon as suicide was mentioned he should have excused himself from the conversation and informed his superiors. That's otherwise know as CYA - covering your own ass.
Had he done so, perhaps they actually would have reviewed Mitanni's presentation and outlined certain things he was to avoid at all costs and this situation never would have happened.
Stop transferring your resentment from those who made this fiasco happen or who allowed it to happen to those who are pointing out how it happened. We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |

Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
503
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 18:43:00 -
[14] - Quote
Lanasak wrote:Kara Roideater wrote:Now, if only people would accept that there was a genuine problem and not a 'non-event' then there would really be nothing left to talk about Nonsense. You took it upon yourself to take a YouTube video, post it in two separate threads and try to shift the discussion towards this "new evidence" while dragging in CCP Soundwave. Another guy (or your alt) posted it in GD and it was locked. Nobody is debating the morality of what he did - Mittani screwed up. You, however, are willing to take down the lead game designer in pursuit of some agenda.
You poor fool. You're calling out the wrong person for the wrong reason. I suggested that CCP bring administrative action against Soundwave. What that action is, I don't care. But in no way did I indicate that he should be "taken down".
It's amusing that your interpretation of the bolton video and the panel video are so narrow that you won't admit how the two are related yet, your interpretation of my statements are so broad that you choose to conclude I want him "taken down". No. What I want is for CCP to handle this in a manner that is proactive rather than reactionary so that if the news of the January video leaves the forum they're seen handling the situation rather than not. Unfortunately, now that people know the LEAD dev is involved such handling will most undoubtedly include Soundwave.
I do think the Mitanni needs a perma-ban as many others have received more permanent punishments for far less.
Hopefully someone has copied the bolton video and can re-post it. Lanasak, if the two videos are unrelated why was the one taken down? We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |

Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
503
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 19:13:00 -
[15] - Quote
Darth Gustav wrote:
If CCP were "entirely justified" they would have called the cops the moment it became apparent to them (read: fanfest) that this "victim" was "suicidal."
Notice how that hasn't happened?
Yet we have it on authority from CCP that their policy (regardless of context--their wording not mine) is to call law enforcement every time. This is as much about caring for the person as it is about keeping people from mindlessly using the suicide card.
Think about it. CCP is not "entirely justified". Not even close.
Justification has nothing to do with it. They're trying to protect Mitanni with a symbolic 30d ban and whomever was involved. Others have received far harsher punishments for much less.
We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |

Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
509
|
Posted - 2012.04.03 12:54:00 -
[16] - Quote
Good to see it again! We want breast augmentations and sluttier clothing in the NeX! |
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